KILL SCREEN 065: For Adam Biggs of RIVERS OF NIHIL, the Fantasy is Something However Ultimate

In truth, this interview nearly didn’t occur. Our dialog with Adam Biggs, bassist and now vocalist for progressive pummelers Rivers of Nihil, has been within the works for months. After bandmate and former participant character Brody Uttley directed the frontman in the direction of the Kill Display screen arcade’s neon glow originally of 2025, plans have been made to hyperlink up at a U.Okay. cease throughout their European tour in March. Because of notoriously dodgy venue wi-fi, nevertheless, the one spot within the constructing that provided any type of service ended up being—of all locations—the mens’ room. Sparing our visitor the indignity, our chat was placed on pause till the group returned dwelling. Scheduling conflicts continued to come up and with mere days left earlier than heading out on a headliner throughout the U.S., the co-nerds lastly caught up with Biggs—calling in from the again of a van parked in a shopping mall car parking zone. Fortunately, no less than, the wi-fi was higher.

It’s removed from an unusual expertise shared in earlier installments of this column, however Biggs is an extremely busy man. Because the profile of the band grows following the discharge of their current self-titled LP, balancing music with household life could make FromSoft seem like Cookie Clicker. Regardless of this, gaming continues to be not simply current, however an important a part of the equation each creatively and emotionally. Along with his Nintendo Change in hand, the lengthy stretches of time touring from stage to stage, metropolis to metropolis, nation to nation presents our topic the possibility to show off the skin world and tune into the expansive pixelated lands which have held quick to his creativeness for years. His digital days are completely different, not over, and we recognize him taking what little time he has to share his digitized notion.

In search of a bit of additional DLC from this dialogue? Remember to choose up the newest problem of Decibel (dB250/August 2025) to study what position storytelling performs within the bassist’s appreciation of contemporary day video games.

What was your first gaming expertise?
I’ve been enjoying video video games technically since earlier than I can bear in mind as a result of my older sister had an NES in the home. She obtained it I feel earlier than I used to be born or once I was just a little child. There was at all times a recreation of Tremendous Mario happening in the home and it was one thing that I obtained instantly interested in. It was a household factor—we’d simply move the controller round and see what number of goombas we may stomp out.

Was it a standard household incidence for you or was this simply whenever you have been actually little youngsters after which she type of grew out of it?
There have been some instances, however as soon as we obtained into the Sega Genesis period, my dad and mom positively didn’t contact it. My sister would play some Sonic [the Hedgehog] every now and then, however that was largely my factor. As soon as we stepped right into a second era of video video games, my dad and mom simply misplaced curiosity totally. [Laughs] It was good instances, hitting the video retailer, renting something I may discover on Genesis. That was a superb variety of years. However yeah, video video games turned solely my factor for probably the most half in the home round that point.

Was there a selected first title that was like, “That is my recreation”?
It’s laborious to say as a result of once I obtained a Genesis, I may need been 8 years outdated, 9 years outdated possibly. I used to be in on all of the hype. I used to be like, “Sonic the Hedgehog, Mario however sooner, blast processing? Let’s go!” Quite a lot of that instantly didn’t enchantment to my dad and mom. They have been like, “This hedgehog has means an excessive amount of perspective. I’m far more comfy with plumbers leaping on mushrooms and stuff.” [Laughs] Which, for some motive, it is sensible.

What have you ever been enjoying recently and what are the video games that you simply sometimes favor to play?
Currently recently, I’ve not been enjoying a lot in any respect as a result of I reserve most of my gaming time for after we’re on tour. At dwelling, I’m working, I’m with my youngsters, squeezing in observe time late at night time after all people goes to mattress. There’s not a lot time for video games happening till we get on the highway and every little thing’s settled, after which I can veg out and play Change for hours. On that final European run we did, I obtained actually sick at one level which was horrible, however I used to be simply in my bunk enjoying Change continuously. I performed by complete runs of some video games. I feel I performed Batman: Arkham Metropolis and Arkham Knight on the Change. [Sarcastically] That Arkham Knight port is gorgeous on the Change. [Laughs] It’s possibly one of many worst working video games I’ve ever performed in my life, however it’s nonetheless enjoyable someway. I similar to Batman loads and I like that recreation.

And I performed Ultimate Fantasy VII begin to end within the bunk as effectively. It was good to revisit that. It’s at all times good to revisit video games like that from my previous. I first performed it once I was in, like, sixth or seventh grade. It was an ongoing mission for a number of years. And now, I’m like, What’s the gameplay perform of this? after which simply rip it aside and go actual quick by it. The thriller of every little thing is just a little shaved down, however it’s enjoyable. It was positively a whole lot of enjoyable doing that.

You’re speaking about some completely different eras of video games as effectively. Do you consciously make a option to play some older stuff and a few current stuff to combine it up?
I’ve been enjoying video games my entire life. I really feel lucky. I wasn’t born on the roots of gaming, however NES is a fairly good place to begin I really feel so far as the tradition of gaming at massive is worried. I’ve that perspective of, That is the roots of actually business dwelling gaming. I’ve gone by each period and picked out my spots of what I discover enjoyable. I really feel like because it occurs with a whole lot of issues whenever you begin to get just a little older, trendy video games have drifted from me just a little bit. There have been an entire bunch of various eras and I actually recognize traditional stuff from nearly any period which you can describe. The PS1 period is nice, issues like Tomb Raider and Ultimate Fantasy and an entire bunch of stuff from that period. That’s massive stuff. Slightly bit later, we began stepping into retro revival gaming. They began making new 8-bit video games and new 16-bit video games and that I believed was actually enjoyable when it stopped all being about how good every little thing seems to be. They made new Mega Man video games. That basically drew me again in for some time. After I speak about gaming as a contemporary factor, possibly with any individual just a little youthful, I hear them speaking about Overwatch or Marvel Rivals, stuff like that, actually intense on-line expertise type of video games and I’m similar to, “That’s not me.” [Laughs] I’m a single-player man. It’s wonderful to see what number of completely different genres of gamer have developed through the years. Everyone performed Tremendous Mario and Tetris once I was a child, and now for those who’re a gamer, that may imply so many various issues.

Past nostalgia, what’s it concerning the PS1 period that you simply really feel these video games obtained proper that trendy gaming has type of misplaced alongside the best way?
I feel Sony and people builders on the time have been pushing laborious to be like, “This has to be the longer term.” Bringing video games right into a 3D house is only a entire different rung of the ladder. I feel it took a whole lot of braveness and a whole lot of thought to make gaming work in that 3D house. It’s not only a cartridge and just a little man working throughout the display anymore. There’s that push to make issues extra cinematic and extra grownup. It combines on this means that possibly on its face it’s clunky and awkward, however I feel the video games that do get it proper, you possibly can inform the builders have been like, “What makes a recreation enjoyable to play?” they usually nonetheless protect that type of factor.

It’s type of laborious to level at examples within the PS1 period which you can utterly wipe nostalgia from it and be like, “Yeah, it is a good recreation.” [Laughs] Even for those who love Resident Evil, you play Resident Evil 1 and 2 and also you’re going to be like, “I like this recreation! These controls are…” [Laughs] I like the ambiance, I even love the story and every little thing, however the controls will gradual you down. It’s that a whole lot of instances. However you possibly can see how by the tip of the PS1 period, you’re enjoying one thing that’s tremendous clunky like Resident Evil, however then you definitely choose up Spyro the Dragon and that feels prefer it has the bones of actually trendy platforming, they figured it out. Being alongside for that have was a very cool factor, I feel.

I feel that’s type of a luxurious that everyone on this name has. We obtained to be there to see that transition, the place a whole lot of youthful folks now haven’t solely existed in a world that at all times had video games, however at all times had these hyper-polished, tremendous tight [experiences].
Actually something is feasible! Like a Grand Theft Auto V, you possibly can actually journey by an entire state in a online game. That’s why I obtained so into Ultimate Fantasy video games once I was a child—as a result of I preferred the explorative ingredient. After I was youthful and nonetheless on NES and Tremendous Nintendo, I used to be obsessive about [The Legend of] Zelda due to the little discoverable parts. The unbridled pleasure of discovery is once they construct that world in there. It was that there’s little breadcrumbs. You go from a Zelda factor and then you definitely go to a Ultimate Fantasy factor—it’s just a little bit larger and just a little bit larger. After which impulsively you’re at Grand Theft Auto and all these open world video games the place the map is big and it’s stuffed with cool stuff, hopefully.

Like Baldur’s Gate 3, a recreation the place you’ll by no means have the identical expertise twice.
I heard that was actually good, and I performed the primary two on PC once I was a child. I didn’t have a whole lot of PC video games, however Baldur’s Gate was one in every of them. That recreation again within the day blew my thoughts, simply having to open this big booklet filled with CDs. Should you go right into a city, it’s a must to put in this disc and stuff. I used to be horrible at it as a result of I didn’t perceive hardcore RPG mechanics, however it was just a little too grownup for me on the time. I’ve thought-about testing Baldur’s Gate 3, however it’s not on the Change most likely. [Laughs] I’d deal with myself to a Change 2 when that comes out. Perhaps they’ll port a few of these extra trendy issues over.

[At the time of this interview,] you’re gearing as much as hit the highway with Holy Fawn, Inter Arma, and Glacial Tomb. Do you typically run into any avid gamers? We all know of no less than one nerd that you simply’re going to be sharing the highway with.
Oh yeah. There’s positively dudes on the market with their Steam Decks able to go. Individuals are far more hardcore about their gaming on the highway than me. [Vocalist] Sean Zatorsky from Dååth was on the final tour and he’s obtained all of the devices. He had the Steam Deck, he had every little thing able to go, ported onto any TV and he had all these items hacked. He’s like, “I can play any recreation on the planet!” I’m like, “Dude, that’s superior.” [Laughs] That’s just a little hardcore for me. On the finish of the day, I’m nonetheless that NES child. I wish to plug in a recreation after which have it run. I’m type of a grumpy outdated man in the case of, “I’ve to to obtain a patch?!” That doesn’t make sense in my head.

Do you have got any video games that you’ve got lined up for this tour that you simply’re excited to dive into?
I used to be truly going over my library of video games final night time and didn’t actually see an entire lot new to know onto. I’m going to should determine that out. I’d play some extra Ultimate Fantasy simply to maintain that practice rolling. I haven’t performed Ultimate Fantasy VIII in a really, very very long time, and I do know that they’d an up to date model that they launched. I’d choose that up and play 75 p.c of it and understand that the sport’s not good like I do each time once I play that recreation. [Laughs]

Ooo, these are preventing phrases!
Yeah, effectively, come at me, as a result of that recreation’s not that good. [Laughs]

As an actual query although, is {that a} standard modus operandi earlier than you exit on tour? You undergo the library otherwise you examine current releases and type of queue up three, 4, 5 video games for a tour?
Generally I’ll get the itch and I’ll be like, I ought to look into what’s on the market that I is likely to be fascinated by catching up on. I’ll possibly queue some issues up if I’m within the temper. It won’t be three or 4 video games, it is likely to be only one. I bear in mind a yr or two in the past when [The Legend of Zelda:] Tears of the Kingdom got here out, I used to be like, Yeah, I assume I’ll do this. I’m certain that can occupy loads of my gaming head house. And it did. [Laughs] I purchased that earlier than we went to Australia and it positively helped me get by a few 14-hour flights and an all-day restoration session in a resort room, in order that was good.

So, if there’s a giant, high-attention title popping out, do you choose that up and say, This will likely be excellent for 2 weeks later after we’re on a aircraft?
I want I saved up with stuff just a little higher. I simply don’t have that a lot religion that newer video games are going to at all times curiosity me. I’m at all times looking out for re-releases of older video games that I like. I’ve seen folks simply be like, “What’s with all these re-releases? It’s simply corporations making the most of folks!” And it’s like, I’m folks. [Laughs] I’ll re-buy the video games I like over and over simply to play them in a brand new context. I’ve been dying for [SquareEnix] to place out a port of Dragon Quest VIII on Change and I’ve performed that recreation a ton of instances on PS2 and Nintendo DS. I’m similar to, Why can’t I play this on Change? However new new video games, I feel there’s a pair issues that I’m trying ahead to. It’s uncommon that issues grasp me, however I’ll at all times take note of a brand new [FromSoftware] title popping out or one thing like that.

Are you going to be choosing up [Elden Ring:] Nightreign?
I doubt it. I didn’t play Elden Ring in any respect. I simply by no means had time to sit down down at a console reliably to play one thing that large. I’ll get round to it will definitely. I’ve seen lots of people hating on it, however I feel that Duskbloods recreation seems to be fairly attention-grabbing. Bloodborne is one in every of my all-time favourite video games and that appears reminiscent. I’ll be enjoying that and attempting to make tedious lore connections to each different FromSoft recreation similar to anyone else I’m certain.

Happening the YouTube rabbit gap, seeing all of the conspiracy theories.
See you quickly, VaatiVidya. [Laughs]

[Rivers of Nihil guitarist] Brody [Uttley] had talked about that there was a tour the place all of you bought hooked on Vampire Survivors. Have you ever since kicked the dependancy?
Oh yeah, I can’t even have a look at the app anymore. There was simply a lot downtime on that specific tour. We’d be sitting in inexperienced rooms and all people’s head is down taking a look at their telephones. I’d simply stroll within the inexperienced room, I’d have a look at all people and I’m like, “What’s up?” And all people would simply go, [looking down] “…Surviving.” [Laughs] And that turned the factor: “Yo dude, you surviving?” And all people can be like, “Yeah man, I’m surviving.” There was a whole lot of disgrace connected to it, it’s simply unhappy. It was enjoyable, however it obtained to some extent the place I’m similar to, Why am I doing this? I don’t know. I gained’t do it once more, however yeah, it was an attention-grabbing time for this band. We’ve by no means been so united in any type of online game factor earlier than.

Don’t get me fallacious, I [Michael] suppose it’s a superb recreation. However fortunately early on—I feel I put possibly 8 hours or one thing into it—I used to be capable of discern [that] that is actually a recreation about watching numbers go up. That’s all it’s.
Yeah. As soon as you determine your little sample of the upgrades and the weapons and you may simply recreation it so that you could simply stroll round in a display filled with enemies that simply dies. It’s enjoyable and type of satisfying in that old-school Dynasty Warriors type of means, in your cellphone the place you’re simply smacking down hordes of enemies however then after some time it did turn into thoughts numbing. I’m like, Perhaps as a substitute of enjoying this recreation I ought to do one thing higher with my time.

You’ve not too long ago taken over vocal duties for the band, you’re about to launch a brand new album, you’re a father of two and also you’re a husband. You’ve a whole lot of shit happening in your life. Why is it vital so that you can maintain video video games as a part of that life?
It’s a factor that I’ve at all times had round. There have been instances in my life the place I’ve bordered on doing it an excessive amount of and it’s distracting from extra urgent issues. However I’ve realized that it type of has turn into a part of my course of as a musician to a level. I really feel like I owe a whole lot of my musical ability to that chill vibe. I’m hanging out, I’ll play some video games after which I become bored with that, [so] I choose up my bass and I observe some stuff. Quite a lot of the inventive course of occurs in that state of enjoying—no matter you’re doing that’s satisfying to you. To shuttle between these two issues, once more, possibly I’ll hit a wall with the video games after which I’m going over and observe after which possibly that’ll catch on for a very long time, or possibly I’ll hit a wall after which I’m going again and I’ll play no matter I used to be enjoying there.

In terms of some extent the place you realize you’re gonna should be within the studio quickly, each second I’m spending enjoying video video games at the moment, up to now I’ve guilted myself and been like, I ought to simply be practising. However now, I do know I would like this to decompress or else I’m gonna be bleeding a stone so far as the music stuff goes. It’s helped me to type of regulate that focus span factor and relax, principally.

Would you then say that not directly gaming turns into a part of that artistic course of if just for the truth that it provides you that outlet to return again to enjoying a music with recent ears?
Yeah. The larger the music factor will get, the extra strain will get added to it and the extra enjoyable will get subtracted. I really feel like interspersing enjoying a recreation after which practising, it takes just a little of that strain off and it takes me again to the fundamentals of, I’m right here, I’m enjoying, I’m having enjoyable. That’s whenever you get one of the best inventive output. There’s something to be mentioned about actually placing a whole lot of strain on your self and squeezing it out, which can occur additionally. However within the informal instances main up, I discover it extra vital to not simply stress myself out for days at a time.

Within the course of of constructing a file, I’ve discovered that I often will hardcore dive right into a recreation. Generally it’s both a very lengthy one or a very troublesome recreation. I feel after we have been making The place Owls Know My Title, within the weeks main as much as studio time I used to be enjoying Zelda II: [The Adventure of Link] loads, an extremely troublesome recreation. However practising Owl songs after which enjoying Zelda II—I beat Zelda II with just a little assist from some save states—now I type of assign that album with that recreation just a little bit. I really feel like there’s at all times been that happening.

Do you have got a recreation assigned to [Rivers of Nihil]?
It was just a little completely different as a result of we recorded this album over a number of completely different periods and it took a very very long time, so I performed a whole lot of completely different stuff. Surprisingly sufficient, I assume I performed Ultimate Fantasy II throughout that point, which is all people’s least favourite Ultimate Fantasy recreation however the pixel remasters had simply come out on the Change. I used to be like, You realize what? I’m going to offer this an sincere shot. And I type of preferred it. I preferred that recreation greater than I believed I’d—greater than I remembered from once I was youthful and performed it on the PS1 Ultimate Fantasy Origins assortment. I do know I’ve talked about Ultimate Fantasy loads on this, however it’s type of a giant sequence in my private canon. I performed that and Ultimate Fantasy V from the pixel remaster, so the self-titled [album] I feel has that behind it just a little bit.

If you’re enjoying these video games, despite the fact that that’s the downtime from practising or writing or engaged on a file, do you ever end up in the midst of an encounter or one thing, you press the pause button and be like, That is precisely what I wanted for that music, type of a unconscious factor? Or are these two totally completely different halves of the mind, so to talk?
It’s not even nearly a recreation, however it’s a good house [where] I can simply type of clear my thoughts whereas I’m enjoying a recreation. I’ll be singing the songs in my head on a regular basis. Even now, they’re continuously enjoying time and again in my head. I really feel like the quantity of familiarity with a bit of music, the higher you’re going to have the ability to carry out it or write it. So yeah, I’ll have these a ha! moments if I’m enjoying and I’m simply excited about a music. Perhaps I’ll think about one thing new or that factor that I wanted to do comes up in my head. However typically it doesn’t. Generally I’m similar to, Yep, I’m going by this entire dungeon now with only a utterly clean thoughts, not excited about music in any respect, and typically that’s what’s wanted.

Rivers’ music showcases plenty of influences past what folks would contemplate conventional steel. Brody had talked about that the PS1 period was notably vital to him by way of musical growth. Are there any composers or soundtracks that you simply really feel are musically vital to you or has gaming at all times simply been extra concerning the down time?
I’m most likely not going to interrupt the mildew with anyone too obscure, however Nobuo Uematsu is a big deal to me. The Ultimate Fantasy VII soundtrack was a giant musical second for me as a child. I don’t bear in mind a soundtrack to something. Perhaps a pair films—like, the Batman theme was a factor that caught in my head and the Jurassic Park theme from films once I was a child. However Ultimate Fantasy VII was the primary online game outdoors of Mario and Zelda the place I’m like, This can be a entire sweeping epic, the place motifs are returned to and reimagined and characters are being constructed with this music. It’s the best idea album ever, simply the best way that the music tells the story of the sport higher than even a whole lot of the dialogue does more often than not. That positively [was] an enormous inspiration on what I recognize in music. I like that to issues like Ultimate Fantasy or Dragon Quest, the place it’s these actually sturdy musical experiences with this sprawling world to discover.

I heard it mentioned someplace: It’s not that I like knights and zombies and preventing monsters all that a lot—I imply, I do like that stuff—however I similar to video games with extra. There’s extra to it: you have got this entire world to discover, there’s one million various things happening, there’s a narrative, there’s all this epic stuff. I’ve at all times thought of that with music, too. Progressive music simply appeared like music with extra, and steel music collectively and all of that. That larger, sturdy expertise from video games, that I feel helped inform what we do musically on the finish of the day, too.

This can be just a little bit extra of a stretch, however Rivers’ lyrics tackle rather more of a philosophical, metaphysical strategy—not your normal gory demise steel subject material. You’re mentioning a whole lot of these very sprawling narratives, like Ultimate Fantasy, like Zelda. Do you suppose any of that fantastical ingredient from video gaming has factored into that lyrical content material or is that simply coincidence?
Completely. Our first 4 data have been this entire interconnected story. There’s the 4 seasons ingredient to it, however I’ve at all times type of handled that entire story as its personal world.Particularly early on, the primary couple data are actually this imagined world. I’d type of construct this world in my head that issues have been taking place in, after which I’d attempt to write about it in a musical means. I used to be like a bard or one thing from the olden days, writing concerning the occasions of this fictional world or attempting to file the occasions of it in an inventive means. Visiting a world of your individual creation or of any individual else’s creation, such as you do in a online game or a film or no matter, that positively had a huge impact on how I got here up with a whole lot of these themes. Afterward it will get just a little extra private, just a little extra grownup, and I feel that’s include age. My world is much less video video games, it’s much less fantasy and it’s extra grownup actuality stuff. However it nonetheless has the kid’s coronary heart beating in there.

So even when it’s not like, “This album is immediately the story of Ultimate Fantasy IV,” however extra that these worlds type of helped inform your means by which you then went to construct and create a world that your music exists in.
Proper. It’s my very own imagined factor after which I can write about it on this context that isn’t the identical factor. However it’s type of imagining that scene, the imagery of this fantastical world that now lives in my head. It’s impressed by all of those different massive fantastical worlds from these video games.

Within the press launch, Brody discusses the closing monitor of the album, which can be self-titled. He says, “The identify ‘Rivers of Nihil’ implies this darkish nihilistic hopeless factor. However lyrically the music is definitely about letting time slip by you and never giving into the darkness.” It is likely to be proximity bias, however all of us have far much less time and are much more wired than we’ve ever been. What’s the recreation that you’d advocate to our readership as a recreation to let that point slip by and decompress?
Hmm. [Pauses] It’s robust as a result of there’s so many choices, however I feel some of the full gaming experiences you possibly can have now are the 2 newer Zelda video games [Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom]. I feel there’s simply a lot. They’re trendy, however they’re not overly trendy. There’s a narrative, however it’s not beating you over the top with it. You’ve that massive world to discover and also you’ll have that pleasure of discovery in these sorts of video games. I discover myself recommending these to folks loads as a result of dwelling in that world, simply leaping in, working round that enormous Hyrule map, it’s very soothing. Getting up within the sky, climbing this mountain and the altering surroundings, for some motive I discover that simply very, very satisfying.

Let’s say any individual confirmed up they usually mentioned, “I’m an agent who represents video video games—all of them. We’d love you to possibly not essentially rating, however no less than inform a soundtrack to a brand new online game. It could possibly be any franchise you need.” Is there something that straight away you’d be like, “Man, I’d like to do a Ultimate Fantasy or a Zelda”?
I’d discover doing Ultimate Fantasy mega intimidating as a result of I do know that I’ve judged all people who’s labored on that franchise who isn’t Nobuo Uematsu very laborious. [Laughs]

Yeah, agree.
I feel the man who’s doing the Ultimate Fantasy VII Remake stuff, although [Masashi Hamauzu]—hats off. That shit’s unbelievable. It was my Spotify primary factor for, like, two years, simply that soundtrack. But when I needed to choose any… [Pauses] Hmm. I must choose one thing that wants higher music, and all I’m pondering of is video games with good music. Mega Man? Nice music. Zelda sequence? Nice music. Even the newer newer Zelda video games, their strategy to their music is is admittedly awe inspiring. I don’t know. Man. I’m pondering of Darkish Souls and Bloodborne, and it’s the use of music in these video games. It’s not the music itself that I feel is so good, however it’s when it is available in and when it’s not there may be so cool. Considering of the newer Doom sequence, the music is so so fucking good in these. What to enhance upon? I ponder.

What for those who may choose a style that you’d be fascinated by engaged on? What fashion of recreation would you suppose is most enjoyable to attain?
In all probability one thing open world, you realize? Some type of explorative kind of factor. If I had say within the music, it must be one thing that has a whole lot of completely different colours to it, a whole lot of completely different moods happening as a result of that’s type of how I wish to function. Any good RPG soundtrack goes to do one thing like that—it’s going to take you thru all of the completely different feelings, however it’s going to carry you again to the roots of what it’s you’re doing. That’s a very laborious query, however a really cool one. I don’t know. There’s so many good video games with music that I actually admire. Far be it for me to say that I’d do a greater job at any of them.

Rivers of Nihil is out now through Metallic Blade Information and may be bought right here.
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